http://store.steampowered.com/app/217200

Worms Armageddon is available on Steam for a limited time with the pre-purchase of Worms Revolution: http://store.steampowered.com/app/200170/

Looks like I finally get to buy WA on Steam and also get a free copy of Revolutions with it as well. Nice.

Wait, what do you mean it's the other way round? :p

Yup, Revolution is a nice little bonus ;)

Great news!

Taken from Steam discussions:
It's based on 3.6.31.0, so it includes all the fixes and improvements from it as well.

I've been waiting for this moment for over 6 years!!!

Hmm - i just registered for Steam but Worms Armageddon doesn't seem to be buyable yet? There is no price or place to click to buy.
Edit: nvm you have to preorder Worms Revolution and it comes bundled as an instant download. Purchased.

This is awesome - mega props to Team17 and anyone involved for making this happen.

So the Steam version will be updated just as often as the non-Steam versions?

Fresh blood!

Verify Integrity of Game Cache appears to be broken? Always returns saying all files validated but then wants to download it all...

I installed it to default location not realizing I can now choose the install location. I have thus:

- copied the completed downloaded copy to the approriate location
- uninstalled the existing copy from Steam
- Reinstalled from Steam and chose appropriate location
- Paused download and verified integrity
- It should say it is installed but no... it wants to download it...

Edit: nevermind.

The Verify Integrity of Game Cache is indeed broken but it performs the action when "installing" the game. I had thought I had copied the game to the correct location but no, I just needed to make a Common folder and copy the game in to that and THEN install the game via Steam.

I've been waiting for this moment for over 6 years!!!
me too!!!!!

I just want to ask when you buy the Worms Revolution Preorder, Is the Worms Armageddon game only appear on your library at the moment I pre purchased it already and I can only see the Worm Armageddon on my Game library, No Worms Revolution. When I buy pre purchase games before it still appears to my library but of course I know I can't download it yet until the release date. To those already bought it can you confirm to me that only Worms Armageddon is there on your steam library?

So the Steam version will be updated just as often as the non-Steam versions?

Yes, future updates are primarily the same for both versions and will be kept synchronised for optimum compatibility

How about WormKit and it's modules?

WormKit is currently fully functional and some modules will continue to work with the current Steam version, but most game-altering mods will need to be updated (e.g. RubberWorm and PX) by their respective developers before they can be used. This has been and will continue to be the case with most updates.

But I wouldn't do it write now, WK developers, I believe there might be some additional changes in the near future so it would all be for nothing.

Downloading now! :D

So long as the water colour editor works, I'll be chuffed as chips. The game looks weird to me without blood red water now! If it doesn't, I'll still be very happy to have this in my (rather small) Steam library. Good work!

And what's with server? Will it be the steam one? And would the hosting problem still be there for those who had it in non-steam version?

I expect it will. You won't need to fiddle about with wkFileOverride any more, either.

are you sure? you probably don't know how does the executable look like, yet you're doing the random statements.
i don't think that anything related to the game offsets has been changed. That is, if there's no need in CD for this version, the game code may be not touched at all
the only possible way of the hard change is if anything Steam-related has been added to the EXE, but we still don't know how would it be added (appending to the end, for example, wouldn't break anything), and I think the WA developers aren't stupid to cheaply let the offsets go.

What part of my statement do you not understand, StepS? At this moment in time, the current Steam version of W:A is 3.6.31.2b - The latest versions of RubberWorm and PX (for 3.6.31.0) do not work with the current Steam version of W:A.

are you sure? you probably don't know how does the executable look like, yet you're doing the random statements.
i don't think that anything related to the game offsets has been changed. That is, if there's no need in CD for this version, the game code may be not touched at all
the only possible way of the hard change is if anything Steam-related has been added to the EXE, but we still don't know how would it be added (appending to the end, for example, wouldn't break anything), and I think the WA developers aren't stupid to cheaply let the offsets go.
The game code has been touched. We know. There have been a few minor bugfixes to the game engine. There has also been an entirely new rendering engine written; in addition, the code is merged with some steam code, for instance to ensure Steam is running when the game is launched. If that doesn't change the offsets, I don't know what will.

The game code has been touched. We know. There have been a few minor bugfixes to the game engine.

I don't see an official confirmation, and I can't confirm that by myself as I didn't buy it from there yet.
If you're saying that there "have been a few minor bugfixes", it would be like posting 3.6.31.2 to the public, man. Not something I'd expect normally :-/

What part of my statement do you not understand, StepS? At this moment in time, the current Steam version of W:A is 3.6.31.2b - The latest versions of RubberWorm and PX (for 3.6.31.0) do not work with the current Steam version of W:A.
I don't see it on the forum? I don't see any official word on this apart from you saying it has it inside. Alpha to the masses then?
Bring me a link confirming it in details

The Steam version of W:A is currently fully compatible with the latest CD beta. As explained already in this thread, the plan is for future updates to be released simultaneously for both user-groups for optimum compatibility (this doesn't mean game versions will be exactly the same). Stop bursting blood vessels; everything is under control xD

Bring me a link confirming it in details

I know it may be a foreign concept to you, but try buying the game :D

As explained already in this thread

huh?

I know it may be a foreign concept to you, but try buying the game :D

i didn't say i'm not going to buy it, my personal plans don't allow me for rushing to buy it right now, not to mention that Steam sucks in my opinion and I didn't get any greal deal about it, nor configured for my visa card. still, that's something i'm hoping to do soon
instead of doing the silly propositions, I'd like to see proper details about the version bundled with the Steam release in the meantime.

Well, why don't you take the word of people who do have it? The (well-tested) bug-fixes of the latest alpha have been combined with the new rendering engine and Steam-specific code. A new beta will be released relatively shortly for both CD and Steam versions that brings the two versions in line. I believe the thinking was that it would be silly releasing a Steam version based on a two-year-old beta when there are well-tested bug fixes in the alphas that can be included as well (but not enough yet to warrant releasing a new beta for CD versions).

You know, I'm asking for the details because I love you all :cool: and if me and Kawoosh had a proper executable by now, the RubberWorm would be updated in no time (that usually takes about 6 hours).
Until then, you'll have to wait for us to buy the game from Steam ;)

Does Kawoosh need someone to rub his feet while he fiddles with the code a little?

Does Kawoosh need someone to rub his feet while he fiddles with the code a little?

are you even sure what you're talking about? it's our job, so shutup :)

If you're saying that there "have been a few minor bugfixes", it would be like posting 3.6.31.2 to the public, man. Not something I'd expect normally :-/

Yes. Oops.

Will the game be made available for purchase after Worms Revolution's release or is it a limited time offer only?

How will this affect online play? Two different online communities or unified? Will the WormNET server be deactivated so you must use the Steam version for online play?

Oh, and how about performance, especially on weaker computers?

How will this affect online play? Two different online communities or unified? Will the WormNET server be deactivated so you must use the Steam version for online play?

Oh, and how about performance, especially on weaker computers?

same wormnet server, but currently Steam users have a newer version of the game than everyone else.

How will this affect online play? Two different online communities or unified? Will the WormNET server be deactivated so you must use the Steam version for online play?

Oh, and how about performance, especially on weaker computers?

Steam doesn't force games to use Steam servers anyway ;)

Steam doesn't force games to use Steam servers anyway ;)

Hm, thought they did.

Anyway, that's good news. I feel sorry for the newbies who'll be thrown together with us veterans... ;)

And what does newer version mean exactly? The previous posts have been unclear, IMO. More existing bugs fixed ala beta update, upgraded engine, art/audio changed or removed, new features - what exactly??

Hm, thought they did.

Anyway, that's good news. I feel sorry for the newbies who'll be thrown together with us veterans... ;)

Eh they'll most likely join the other "newbies" that already inhabit regular wormnet and play Shoppa all day. Or maybe not, whatever.

I have a certain hope we get a lot of the people I know from playing recent releases to play Armageddon as well. Now that it's on Steam I can probably play standard schemes without having to wait for ages for people to join my lobby. Even better, with people from my Steam communities! In other words, I hope this is enough motivation for me to play W:A on a regular basis again :)

Basically, the steam version has:

* A few minor bug fixes in the game engine and elsewhere.
* An entirely new rendering engine that does a lot more in software (so it has higher CPU requirement)
* A few bits of content that could be considered a bit iffy in these politically correct times have been removed or changed - mostly speech banks, etc., but also the Euthanasia training mission has changed name.
* A few tweaks to the binary required for Steam (eg stuff to make sure Steam is open when you play, etc.)

The first two changes will be included in the next beta for disc users. The latter two will remain Steam exclusive features (so we won't lose any content).

Basically, the steam version has:

* An entirely new rendering engine that does a lot more in software (so it has higher CPU requirement)

The first two changes will be included in the next beta for disc users. The latter two will remain Steam exclusive features (so we won't lose any content).

When most software goes HW, W:A goes SW.
Great and awful work if true.

When most software goes HW, W:A goes SW.
Great and awful work if true.
I imagine the problem is WA's 1999 hardware rendering is worse than today's software rendering. :p

* An entirely new rendering engine that does a lot more in software (so it has higher CPU requirement)

How much higher?

I'm not worried for me, it's just that WA has always been able to run on low-power computers.

Balee did a very, very rough measurement that it was around 3* higher. I don't know how much of that was WA and how much was steam running in the background. I don't know if anyone has done a more accurate measurement either.

Balee did a very, very rough measurement that it was around 3* higher.

Is that 3 times higher?

Yep, sorry, I should have also said 3 times as high. Stupid English (yes, it IS my native language ;)).

Well, 3 times higher at long last puts very low-end computers out of the equation, but anybody with a half-decent rig by today's standards ought to do fine.

Don't be silly guys, the CPU usage is nearly identical between versions. It is for me at 1280 × 800, at least, and I imagine people with very old hardware won't be running the game at much higher resolutions either.

So the software renderer is already active for the Steam version? Good work then! Works fine and no input lag introduced unlike ProjectX's Direct3D mode which adds huge input lag. Also explains the high system requirements on the Steam store page (http://store.steampowered.com/app/217200/). (which people here seem to not be checking)

Question: Is the Software Renderer more compatible with laptop video chipsets?

Edit: No Steam forum :/ http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=1213 (Though there is god awful Community Discussions place http://steamcommunity.com/app/217200/discussions/)

Because there's nowhere else to put this: The ►►► Game Problems: Please Read Before Posting ◄◄◄ sticky in this forum should probably be updated, it currently says that only CD versions are supported, which is no-longer true!

Works fine and no input lag introduced unlike ProjectX's Direct3D mode which adds huge input lag.

these are different things. ProjectX's renderer was somewhat heavier, and doesn't work on weak PCs. in particular, a lighter Delphi compiler could also be used, but the creator doesn't seem to care anymore ;)

Cybershadow, can you consider having a Steam forum? A lot of users still prefer them over the Discussion area. http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/index.php

Apparently it is up to the devs to make one? http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showpost.php?p=32805847&postcount=658

Cybershadow, can you consider having a Steam forum? A lot of users still prefer them over the Discussion area. http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/index.php

Apparently it is up to the devs to make one? http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showpost.php?p=32805847&postcount=658

this is a good idea, someone can put up a guide for noobs on how to survive in a shoppa lobby for longer than 3 seconds.

this is a good idea, someone can put up a guide for noobs on how to survive in a shoppa lobby for longer than 3 seconds.

rulz plz

lol unoob

The host has removed you from their lobby.

Basically, the steam version has:

* A few minor bug fixes in the game engine and elsewhere.
* An entirely new rendering engine that does a lot more in software (so it has higher CPU requirement)
* A few bits of content that could be considered a bit iffy in these politically correct times have been removed or changed - mostly speech banks, etc., but also the Euthanasia training mission has changed name.
* A few tweaks to the binary required for Steam (eg stuff to make sure Steam is open when you play, etc.)

The first two changes will be included in the next beta for disc users. The latter two will remain Steam exclusive features (so we won't lose any content).

Can you elaborate on the bolded part? What exactly has changed? I heard a few soundbanks were canned (annoying as a Scot, as I loved the Angry Scots, but then again I'll just put them back in the game from my old CD). What's the parts that changed that I won't be able to 'fix'?

Eh they'll most likely join the other "newbies" that already inhabit regular wormnet and play Shoppa all day.
What's wrong with shopper?

(which people here seem to not be checking)
)
I did check, and I was like "What the...?" but now I saw it has a new rendering engine. Didn't see that one coming.

rulz plz

lol unoob

The host has removed you from their lobby.

Laughing uncontrollably.

I'm not sure if I'm imagining it but it seems that the #AG lobby elements no longer support accelerated mouse wheel scrolling? They now scroll at a fixed speed regardless of how fast you scroll the mouse wheel?

They seem to scroll really slowly here like the chat and player list etc.

What's the parts that changed that I won't be able to 'fix'?

you'll never get that microprose screen back

you'll never get that microprose screen back

lol. just imagined: what if there was a huge STEAM screen :D

this is a good idea, someone can put up a guide for noobs on how to survive in a shoppa lobby for longer than 3 seconds.

Done! :p

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2935767

We need more Armageddon players, I don't want them to get frustrated with multiplayer. We need to drop our elitism attitude and introduce them to the joys that is Worms Armageddon.

Here is another small difference between the Steam and CD versions of WA. The Indian Nuclear Test is now just called Nuclear Test, even though it keeps the same image.

You know, I'm asking for the details because I love you all :cool: and if me and Kawoosh had a proper executable by now, the RubberWorm would be updated in no time (that usually takes about 6 hours).
Until then, you'll have to wait for us to buy the game from Steam ;)

You can decrease the time to find your pointer by a tool called asmdiff.
It takes two binaries (an old and a new) and you provide the addresses from the old binary. asmdiff gives you the new pointers in the new binary then

See: http://duschkumpane.org/index.php/asmdiff

They've implemented some interesting metrics to make sure the new pointers are correct (they're using it by themselves for their mmorpg's helpers).

Here is another small difference between the Steam and CD versions of WA. The Indian Nuclear Test is now just called Nuclear Test, even though it keeps the same image.

Where are you seeing the difference, here? The weapon description names it as "Indian Nuclear Test" and the weapon panel in-game labels it as "Nuclear Test", but this seems to be identical in both 3.6.31.0 and the Steam version.

Where are you seeing the difference, here? The weapon description names it as "Indian Nuclear Test" and the weapon panel in-game labels it as "Nuclear Test", but this seems to be identical in both 3.6.31.0 and the Steam version.

classic.... if i remember rightly you should see this (and also the french sheep strike) at the top of the screen if you're lucky enough to get one in a crate

Where are you seeing the difference, here? The weapon description names it as "Indian Nuclear Test" and the weapon panel in-game labels it as "Nuclear Test", but this seems to be identical in both 3.6.31.0 and the Steam version.
My memory must be playing tricks on me if that's always been the case. I saw it that way both in the weapons panel and in the Crate Spy contents so I assumed it had been changed. But yes, it seems the name is still Indian Nuclear Test in the weapon settings scheme menu and when you pick up a crate. So I guess it didn't change.

Guys, I'm trying to host with the steam version using WormNat, but doesn't work.
Any help, to host with with WormNat or another way, if I'm using a router?
Thanks

You can see your options here: http://worms2d.info/Hosting_Guide

WormKit.exe doesn't work with the Steam version. You'll need to use something like WormKitDS (http://worms2d.info/WormKitDS) for now.

I am very pleased to see that Worms Armageddon is finally on Steam! Will later updates include Steam Achievements and Steam Cloud, because it's kind of annoying having to transfer the WG team file and custom schemes/soundbanks/flags/graves every time. Also, a friend invite option through Steam would be nice too, and I'm guessing I won't need a CD anymore with this either?

No, Steam WA has no CD.

I hope this is enough motivation for me to play W:A on a regular basis again :)


If all the latest betas, the new schemes and new third party features of WA hasn't been enough to get you back to play regularly (something you never did, that I recall, anyway) WA being on Steam certainly won't.

But you can pretend to play it like you've been doing so you have a reason to post in this particular forum and interact with this particular community (I guess the others, from other more recent worm games suck, in comparison, hence you here)

bye m8

is wkprivatecfg compatible with the steam version?

bump. I would really appreciate the question being answered.

No, wkPrivateCfg relies on the offsets specific to 3.6.31.0...
once we see the new update (which is expected to be soon), all these modules will be ported to the new update. :)

So I guess the steam version still uses the registry for saving settings. Great :(

So uh, is there any sort of nicely formatted update history for WA from x amount of years ago up until now?

http://worms2d.info/Beta_updates_(Worms_Armageddon)

So uh, is there any sort of nicely formatted update history for WA from x amount of years ago up until now?

Do you mean a change log? You can view that here: http://worms2d.info/Worms_Armageddon_ReadMe_%28English%29#Version_Hist ory (Or install the latest beta update and see "WA_Readme-3.6.31.0_Beta.rtf")

If all the latest betas, the new schemes and new third party features of WA hasn't been enough to get you back to play regularly (something you never did, that I recall, anyway) WA being on Steam certainly won't.

But you can pretend to play it like you've been doing so you have a reason to post in this particular forum and interact with this particular community (I guess the others, from other more recent worm games suck, in comparison, hence you here)

bye m8

It's people like you putting me off from playing this game. As far as the online mode is concerned, I was really looking for a way to play it without having to rely on the online community which feels like a bad joke, if you were ever to compare it to other gaming communities. On top of the rather low playercount most of the people are only playing with their ropes too. Try to see the situation from a person that is only spending 30 - 45 minutes playing this game per day at most. Do you think this person is ever going to find a decent match in Worms Armageddon?

With W:A being a pre-order bonus for W:Rev several of my Steam friends have taken the opportunity to aquire it and we've formed Steam groups in order to match up. I can play online anytime I want without having to bother with the usual WormNet morons. That's all I'm saying.

Also, please fix your magic wand that allows you to see the online play time of all players of the world. It appears to be out of order.

(Or install the latest beta update and see "WA_Readme-3.6.31.0_Beta.rtf")

not for Steam version.
readme is here (ftp://ftp.team17.com/pub/t17/patches/pc/WA_Readme-3.6.31.0_Beta.zip)

Is a manual being made for W:A to include with W:A on Steam?

Is a manual being made for W:A to include with W:A on Steam?

Steamversion of W:A has a standard Team17 WA manual inside (in pdf format). It is untouched, a few errors are listed on WKB about it. Not sure if it's going to be further documented

i wonder, since the offer ended, will W:A become available to buy sometimes on steam?

W:A was bundled with W:R, did W:A's rating impact the rating of W:R? (I mean the age rating, M, MA, PG etc.)

If yes then is it possible, now that the game is no longer sold on Steam to have the old content (Speech banks etc.) added back? Since it wouldn't impact the W:R rating now.

W:A was bundled with W:R, did W:A's rating impact the rating of W:R? (I mean the age rating, M, MA, PG etc.)

Of course not. That would be insane.

Of course not. That would be insane.

Well it would explain why they cut certain speech banks from the game :/ (They didn't want the pre-order package/deal to be higher rated then the stand alone W:R game)

I think the reason why they cut certain speechbanks from the game is because people today would be less tolerant of a game which features worms shouting "Poppadom!" (as an example) as they fall from a bungee rope, than they would be back in '99.

I've always thought this would be a good way of increasing popularity. We just need a high profile Indian person to kick up a fuss about how W:A is racist.
There's no publicity like bad publicity!

I think it's more likely that they want to keep WA's 3+ rating (which it had historically) for if they ever release it separately. I dunno, though. Apparently some of the speech banks removed from WA turn up nearly verbatim in WR, which if true (though I haven't given it a try) would further support this theory.

There are new versions of the Angry Scots and Rasta speechbanks in Revolution, yes.

Just noticed a problem after playing with a friend online:

If you click a link in Wormnet your default web browser opens that link in the background. So far, so good.
When you quit WA now Steam thinks that the game is still running (I guess because the browser was launched as a sub process of WA) and the Steam overlay hooks into the browser window, which is very annoying.

It should be easy to recreate this (I'm using Firefox 16). I hope this can be fixed...

i wonder, since the offer ended, will W:A become available to buy sometimes on steam?

This! I missed the offer but would really like to buy this!!

This! I missed the offer but would really like to buy this!!

Me too, please make it happen T17.

Found it on a dutch site (I'm from The Netherlands), delivered in 2 days :D

http://www.bol.com/nl/p/worms-2-worms-armageddon/1004004000003561/

according to a user from steam discussions:

I contacted team 17 steam support to see if I could buy W:A seperately and they said no and that they dont have plans to release it for this year. I wonder whos taking care of the marketing segment at team 17...!?

according to a user from steam discussions:

You want the answer to that question there?
Noone

Wow, I completely missed this offer!

But here's the thing - I don't want Worms Revolution. I want Worms Armageddon standalone on Steam. Why would they release the game on Steam for a limited time, and exclusively to a small portion of people (many of which probably don't want or care about it)?

Worms Armageddon is an excellent game and an excellent piece of gaming history. It deserves a proper Steam and/or GOG release.

Worms Armageddon is an excellent game and an excellent piece of gaming history.

I hope Andy Davison is using this same line daily back at the Team17 headquarters.

He might convince the current staff, if only by repetition.

To my knowledge Davidson initially left Team17 stating Worms Armageddon didn't turn out the way he wanted, so that doesn't seem too likely

I'm curious to see what his opinion is on it now, after all the beta patches tho.

To my knowledge Davidson initially left Team17 stating Worms Armageddon didn't turn out the way he wanted, so that doesn't seem too likely
You're sort of twisting the truth a little there. He wasn't satisfied with WA because he had a load more features planned for it that T17 wouldn't put in (due to lack of time presumably) from what he's said.

To my knowledge Davidson initially left Team17 stating Worms Armageddon didn't turn out the way he wanted, so that doesn't seem too likely

What Muzer said plus take your butthurtness elsewhere buddy, hating on WA ain't getting you a job, well, maybe at Team17.

Maybe Davidson had much better things in his head which would've made W:A even more awesome, but T17 didn't want to put it in cuz of time / $$$

We can maybe ourselves into a hole if we like, but in the end we'll never know. And I'm fine with that. It's none of our business, and whether WA met Andy's expectations or not it's still one of the best entries in the series, second only to Worms: The Director's Cut.

IMO, we should combine all our efforts on a nagging campaign to make Andy D. release his secret patch for Worms DC.
And get him to implement network support.

he had a secret patch for W:DC? :eek:

What Muzer said plus take your butthurtness elsewhere buddy, hating on WA ain't getting you a job, well, maybe at Team17.

I'm not hating on W:A, just on the community. Given the rudeness in your post though it is safe to say you are, in fact, the butthurt one.

I'm curious to see what his opinion is on it now, after all the beta patches tho.

Well, we do know his opinion on Worms Revolution from interviews and chats on this forum. Not actually trying to imply anything here.

No seriously, just drop it. We aren't going to know anyways.

IMO, we should combine all our efforts on a nagging campaign to make Andy D. release his secret patch for Worms DC.
And get him to implement network support.

There is the original Worms and its expansion on Steam - if we could somehow get this game to support online play (not that pseudo-online multiplayer we have now) I'd be all satisfied.

On a sidenote; I've never been thinking too much about it, but why exactly do you think Worms DC is so much better than Worms United (at least you are implying this, I guess)? There are not too many differences, both games are lacking something the other game has, mostly concerning features and not the additional weapons in DC though.

Have you even played WormsDC, Thurbo?

Also Angelus was talking about Worms Armageddon, not Worms Revolution.

he had a secret patch for W:DC? :eek:
Yes.
According to Squirminator, he had been working on an update that was never released.
There is the original Worms and its expansion on Steam - if we could somehow get this game to support online play (not that pseudo-online multiplayer we have now) I'd be all satisfied.
During the beta testing of W:U, I fiddled around with modem/IPX emulation in DOSBox, which W:U on Steam comes pre-installed with.
I never tried it with a second person, but I hosted a server and could ping it on my local machine.
With appropriately set up port forwarding this should also work across a network.
On a sidenote; I've never been thinking too much about it, but why exactly do you think Worms DC is so much better than Worms United (at least you are implying this, I guess)? There are not too many differences, both games are lacking something the other game has, mostly concerning features and not the additional weapons in DC though.
Except for the (unintuitive command line) modem/IPX multiplayer, the elusive (because bugged) mole bomb, and a bunch of single player missions, Worms DC has everything that WU has, and much more.

Most importantly it has many of the weapons that appeared in W2 on PC later in the same year.
Classics like homing pigeon, mad cows, old woman, ming vase, nuke, concrete donkey, mail strike, super sheep, sheep strike and several more.
Not to forget the legendary Sheep-on-a-rope.

WDC is basically Worms 1.5.
I'd even go so far to say that it is Worms 2 ported to the old engine.
Both games were released in 1997, so they were practically developed in parallel.

Doesn't WDC also have modem play? I would have expected it to, being on the Amiga and all.

Have you even played WormsDC, Thurbo?

Yeah, and now I want to know :-/ I honestly can't figure out why it's said to be better than United;

Except for the (unintuitive command line) modem/IPX multiplayer, the elusive (because bugged) mole bomb, and a bunch of single player missions, Worms DC has everything that WU has, and much more.

Most importantly it has many of the weapons that appeared in W2 on PC later in the same year.
Classics like homing pigeon, mad cows, old woman, ming vase, nuke, concrete donkey, mail strike, super sheep, sheep strike and several more.
Not to forget the legendary Sheep-on-a-rope.

WDC is basically Worms 1.5.
I'd even go so far to say that it is Worms 2 ported to the old engine.
Both games were released in 1997, so they were practically developed in parallel.

Unless I am missing something, Worms United still has a number of features that Worms DC doesn't, including retreat time and the ability to zoom in and out, for instance. I realize there are some other important features in DC such as teams, but overall I don't see anything cruzial enough to say Worms DC is downright better than Worms United.

Edit - forgot about that, I wish there were team colours in Worms DC. Without them it's really confusing at times.

Retreat time is one of the things that Andy Davidson has in his mystery patch. But WDC does have retreat time for the important weapons to have it (dynamite, mine, ming vase).

Yeah, and now I want to know :-/ I honestly can't figure out why it's said to be better than United;

Unless I am missing something, Worms United still has a number of features that Worms DC doesn't, including retreat time and the ability to zoom in and out, for instance. I realize there are some other important features in DC such as teams, but overall I don't see anything cruzial enough to say Worms DC is downright better than Worms United.

Edit - forgot about that, I wish there were team colours in Worms DC. Without them it's really confusing at times.

WormsDC is better than United for a number of reasons.

Firstly, from a historical standpoint, it's very important to the Worms series as a whole. My understanding is that when Team17 were developing Worms 2 they basically just wanted to make it an "updated" version of Worms. They had zero intention of adding new weapons or features. Andy used WormsDC to show the team that actually there were still plenty of new weapon ideas that would not only work, but add something new to the game. Most Worms fans feel that a Worms game without the Super Sheep or Holy Hand Grenade is scarcely a Worms game at all - these weapons would not even be in a Worms game were it not for WormsDC.

Secondly, customization. No Worms game before or since has anywhere even close to the amount of customization options that WormsDC has. It was the first Worms game to properly support custom soundbanks, rather than requiring the player to overwrite one of the three language options, and is unique in its handling fo soundbank logic (http://worms2d.info/Soundbanks_(first_generation,_Amiga)#WormsDC_sound bank_logic) which allows speechbanks with potentially unlimited variations of responses for certain circumstances.

For map-makers, it's the only Worms game that lets you create a custom "background" layer for maps, allowing you to create a map where your worms can, for example, walk into a house and up the stairs, past the walls etc. It was the first game to introduce Graffiti Mode, and the only Worms game that allows you to create your own terrain styles (such as Hell, Forest, etc.).

Thirdly, it's filled with improvements.

For ropers, Roping was born here. It was the first Worms game that let you "Tarzan" with the Rope, the first Worms game that let you drop a weapon from the Rope (although the only weapon you can drop is Dynamite), and it has arguably the best Rope in any Worms game - even better than the Rope in WA, though that's obviously just my opinion. A worm attached to a Rope who goes off the edge of the screen is not lost unless the player taps space to let go. The Rope has full 180-degree aiming, which means you can aim directly downwards, do a vertical jump with Backspace (WormsDC is the first game to introduce different jumps, by the way) and tap space, allowing you to Rope across the surface of the landscape. There's also the Sheep-on-a-Rope, which is the only Rope-based weapon in the game's entire 17-year history.

The Shopper was invented here, too - a cheatcode enables Shoppa mode, replacing the mines with weapon crates, and increasing the chance of crate deployment between turns.

It's the only Worms game in which the Mortar is useful.

It's the only Worms game in which the Super Sheep can go into the water without needing to activate a cheat first.

It's the only Worms game where you can aim the Baseball Bat in a full 180-degree arc.

It's the only Worms game where, with the use of a simple cheatcode, Worms can walk across the water.

It's the only Worms game with cheatcodes that drastically alter the way random levels are generated (http://worms2d.info/Cheats_(first_generation)#Landscape_Generator_chea t_codes).

It may not look as flashy as Worms United. It may be missing features such as Retreat Time, or "aimable" Dynamite, or Network Play. But it more than makes up for that in other areas. No other Worms game comes close.

Also, Magical Mystery Tour!

I'll have to ask Deadcode what ever happened to that testing session we had a few years ago.
He seemed quite excited about adding such a feature to WA (and extend it).

Oh, Magical Mystery Tour. What a mode.

Would you mind telling a noob who happens to be me what the heck magical mystery tour is? Just a funny M-M-T abbrevation or more? :mad::cool:

See for yourself. (http://worms2d.info/Cheats_(first_generation)#Worms:_The_Directors_Cut )

Press Del two times in W:A :P
ok its not forced
but well

WormsDC is better than United for a number of reasons.

Firstly, from a historical standpoint, it's very important to the Worms series as a whole. My understanding is that when Team17 were developing Worms 2 they basically just wanted to make it an "updated" version of Worms. They had zero intention of adding new weapons or features. Andy used WormsDC to show the team that actually there were still plenty of new weapon ideas that would not only work, but add something new to the game. Most Worms fans feel that a Worms game without the Super Sheep or Holy Hand Grenade is scarcely a Worms game at all - these weapons would not even be in a Worms game were it not for WormsDC.

Secondly, customization. No Worms game before or since has anywhere even close to the amount of customization options that WormsDC has. It was the first Worms game to properly support custom soundbanks, rather than requiring the player to overwrite one of the three language options, and is unique in its handling fo soundbank logic (http://worms2d.info/Soundbanks_(first_generation,_Amiga)#WormsDC_sound bank_logic) which allows speechbanks with potentially unlimited variations of responses for certain circumstances.

For map-makers, it's the only Worms game that lets you create a custom "background" layer for maps, allowing you to create a map where your worms can, for example, walk into a house and up the stairs, past the walls etc. It was the first game to introduce Graffiti Mode, and the only Worms game that allows you to create your own terrain styles (such as Hell, Forest, etc.).

Thirdly, it's filled with improvements.

For ropers, Roping was born here. It was the first Worms game that let you "Tarzan" with the Rope, the first Worms game that let you drop a weapon from the Rope (although the only weapon you can drop is Dynamite), and it has arguably the best Rope in any Worms game - even better than the Rope in WA, though that's obviously just my opinion. A worm attached to a Rope who goes off the edge of the screen is not lost unless the player taps space to let go. The Rope has full 180-degree aiming, which means you can aim directly downwards, do a vertical jump with Backspace (WormsDC is the first game to introduce different jumps, by the way) and tap space, allowing you to Rope across the surface of the landscape. There's also the Sheep-on-a-Rope, which is the only Rope-based weapon in the game's entire 17-year history.

The Shopper was invented here, too - a cheatcode enables Shoppa mode, replacing the mines with weapon crates, and increasing the chance of crate deployment between turns.

It's the only Worms game in which the Mortar is useful.

It's the only Worms game in which the Super Sheep can go into the water without needing to activate a cheat first.

It's the only Worms game where you can aim the Baseball Bat in a full 180-degree arc.

It's the only Worms game where, with the use of a simple cheatcode, Worms can walk across the water.

It's the only Worms game with cheatcodes that drastically alter the way random levels are generated (http://worms2d.info/Cheats_(first_generation)#Landscape_Generator_chea t_codes).

It may not look as flashy as Worms United. It may be missing features such as Retreat Time, or "aimable" Dynamite, or Network Play. But it more than makes up for that in other areas. No other Worms game comes close.

it's also clearly one of the games that hit you deep in the nostalgia guts

I have access to every single version of Worms that has ever been released, from the original game on the Amiga, PC, Game Boy, etc. right the way through to Revolution. I have Armageddon for the PC, I have Blast for the Advance, I have Golf for the iPad and Revolution for the PS3.

WormsDC is the game I keep coming back to. I go through phases with the other games, even with Armageddon, but WormsDC gets played consistently. I'd kill for that secret patch Andy Davidson has been working on.

I have never played wormsDC. Could never find a working rom/emulator combo :|

Did you try Amiga Forever (http://amigaforever.com/)?

During the beta testing of W:U, I fiddled around with modem/IPX emulation in DOSBox, which W:U on Steam comes pre-installed with.
I never tried it with a second person, but I hosted a server and could ping it on my local machine.
With appropriately set up port forwarding this should also work across a network.

Yeah DOSBox has working network/internet support ^_^ I was able to try BLOOD with someone (Game has no source port/decent windows port) a year or so ago thanks to it, was a little laggy because of the location of the other guy but other then that worked fine.

Press Del two times in W:A :P
ok its not forced
but well
You said it yourself, it's not enforced, thus, it's completely useless as a game mode.

In WDC, the magical mystery tour simply removed all worms names.
Nothing more was necessary, as there were no team colors.

When we tested this, we were coming up with a 5-stage option for this, where increasingly more is hidden.
The toughest level would remove anything, including health points, names, colors.
With only a bunch of identical worms on the map, you would have to remember all positions from the start and after each turn.

The Worm Select utility becomes very useful then.

in Px, any worm labels, their colors and names can easily be changed/erased with the needed functions :)

I can't say I'm quite satisfied with that explanation. Too much "for historical reasons" and "my opinion" in there, I guess :-/
Well, lemme see.

Firstly, from a historical standpoint, it's very important to the Worms series as a whole. My understanding is that when Team17 were developing Worms 2 they basically just wanted to make it an "updated" version of Worms. They had zero intention of adding new weapons or features. Andy used WormsDC to show the team that actually there were still plenty of new weapon ideas that would not only work, but add something new to the game. Most Worms fans feel that a Worms game without the Super Sheep or Holy Hand Grenade is scarcely a Worms game at all - these weapons would not even be in a Worms game were it not for WormsDC.

Yeah, but what's that making it a better game than United? Let's count it as more weapons :p

Secondly, customization. No Worms game before or since has anywhere even close to the amount of customization options that WormsDC has. It was the first Worms game to properly support custom soundbanks, rather than requiring the player to overwrite one of the three language options, and is unique in its handling fo soundbank logic (http://worms2d.info/Soundbanks_(first_generation,_Amiga)#WormsDC_sound bank_logic) which allows speechbanks with potentially unlimited variations of responses for certain circumstances.

I don't get that one, I'm fairly sure I can add an unlimited amount of custom soundbanks to United without overwriting anything. The "soundbank" logic is quite a nice thing though. If I understand it correctly, it's working this way in Revolution now - if only the game allowed custom soundbanks :(

For map-makers, it's the only Worms game that lets you create a custom "background" layer for maps,[...]

Worms Reloaded

[...]allowing you to create a map where your worms can, for example, walk into a house and up the stairs, past the walls etc. It was the first game to introduce Graffiti Mode, and the only Worms game that allows you to create your own terrain styles (such as Hell, Forest, etc.).

Okay, United doesn't have a Graffiti mode and no terrain styles. However, custom landscapes (including custom soundtracks, backgrounds AND gravity/friction settings) are still an option. Basically, there is full custom level support, it's just more uncomfortable.

For ropers, Roping was born here. It was the first Worms game that let you "Tarzan" with the Rope, the first Worms game that let you drop a weapon from the Rope (although the only weapon you can drop is Dynamite), and it has arguably the best Rope in any Worms game - even better than the Rope in WA, though that's obviously just my opinion. A worm attached to a Rope who goes off the edge of the screen is not lost unless the player taps space to let go. The Rope has full 180-degree aiming, which means you can aim directly downwards, do a vertical jump with Backspace (WormsDC is the first game to introduce different jumps, by the way) and tap space, allowing you to Rope across the surface of the landscape. There's also the Sheep-on-a-Rope, which is the only Rope-based weapon in the game's entire 17-year history.

I'd like to say I'm a bit annoyed by the fact that you don't take fall damage when dropping from the rope and that you never lose your kinetic energy. I don't know what rope I prefer in the end, but in DC it's insanely overpowered. Incredible speed, can be shot at any angle (and you can reattach it to the ground as well) and no fall damage, geez :p

The Shopper was invented here, too - a cheatcode enables Shoppa mode, replacing the mines with weapon crates, and increasing the chance of crate deployment between turns.

So not exactly the W:A shopper type I assume. I hope this isn't sounding as if I liked Shoppa in W:A, just for clarification.

It may not look as flashy as Worms United. It may be missing features such as Retreat Time, or "aimable" Dynamite, or Network Play. But it more than makes up for that in other areas. No other Worms game comes close.

This is opinion, I guess.

As stated before, I can't find anything cruzial enough to say Worms DC is clearly better than Worms United.

Yeah, but what's that making it a better game than United? Let's count it as more weapons :p

Worms United got one new weapon. WormsDC got almost 20, almost all of which made it into Worms 2. Worms United's sole addition didn't make it beyond... well, Worms United.


I don't get that one, I'm fairly sure I can add an unlimited amount of custom soundbanks to United without overwriting anything. The "soundbank" logic is quite a nice thing though. If I understand it correctly, it's working this way in Revolution now - if only the game allowed custom soundbanks :(

As I said, it was the first game to properly support additional soundbanks, not the only one. And the soundbank logic is pretty spiffy, though obviously limited depending on how much memory your Amiga has (not an issue with emulation, mind).

Worms Reloaded
Doesn't work in quite the same way, I'm afraid. With WormsDC you basically create two images - a front layer and a back layer. The back layer goes behind the front one (obviously), which means you could use the back layer to create, say, the inside of a house, or the walls of a cave, or whatever you like. It's a lot of fun to experiment with - secret passages, anyone? :)

Okay, United doesn't have a Graffiti mode and no terrain styles. However, custom landscapes (including custom soundtracks, backgrounds AND gravity/friction settings) are still an option. Basically, there is full custom level support, it's just more uncomfortable.

Gravity and friction is in WormsDC custom maps, too. In fact it was in custom maps for the original Worms on the Amiga. The key difference now is that WormsDC comes with a special tool, WormPrefs (http://worms2d.info/WormPrefs), that allows you to properly adjust these settings as well as changing things like the sky and water colours, as well as which sort of water you'd like use.

I'd like to say I'm a bit annoyed by the fact that you don't take fall damage when dropping from the rope and that you never lose your kinetic energy. I don't know what rope I prefer in the end, but in DC it's insanely overpowered. Incredible speed, can be shot at any angle (and you can reattach it to the ground as well) and no fall damage, geez :p

The lack of fall damage is disappointing, and the Rope does occasionally go a bit squiffy, but my understanding is that the lack of damage is a bug, not a feature, though it may as well be a feature considering we've only had the one patch in 17 years.


So not exactly the W:A shopper type I assume. I hope this isn't sounding as if I liked Shoppa in W:A, just for clarification.

I've never played a Shoppa game, so I couldn't comment.

This is opinion, I guess.

As stated before, I can't find anything cruzial enough to say Worms DC is clearly better than Worms United.

Then, honestly, you're not looking hard enough. Worms United has the gloss, but WormsDC has the feature set. It may not look as pretty but it's got a lot more going for it.

As I said, it was the first game to properly support additional soundbanks, not the only one. And the soundbank logic is pretty spiffy, though obviously limited depending on how much memory your Amiga has (not an issue with emulation, mind).

How can it be the first if Worms United released before Worms DC? Looks like I'm misinformed about some important fact.

Doesn't work in quite the same way, I'm afraid. With WormsDC you basically create two images - a front layer and a back layer. The back layer goes behind the front one (obviously), which means you could use the back layer to create, say, the inside of a house, or the walls of a cave, or whatever you like. It's a lot of fun to experiment with - secret passages, anyone? :)

It actually works pretty much in the same way. In Worms Reloaded, only pixels with an alpha value of 255 become part of the foreground, whereas 254 and below become the back layer. The game also transists the transparency settings to the landscape file, meaning you can add fancy transparent objects to the background layer such as a window for your house :p
"Secret passages" (http://wormgineers.com/index.php?page=File&id=402) are also possible, of course, as you probably can tell from the screenshot.

The lack of fall damage is disappointing, and the Rope does occasionally go a bit squiffy, but my understanding is that the lack of damage is a bug, not a feature, though it may as well be a feature considering we've only had the one patch in 17 years.

I'm sure it's a feature. Otherwise, I'd like to see you detach yourself from the rope without taking fall damage :D

Then, honestly, you're not looking hard enough. Worms United has the gloss, but WormsDC has the feature set. It may not look as pretty but it's got a lot more going for it.

Well, I'm sorry then. I really enjoy playing both games, but I can't see how one is better than the other. Worms United defintely has a number of features I enjoy that DC is lacking, not to mention United has that incredibly challenging but very much entertaining single-player mode.

I'm sure it's a feature. Otherwise, I'd like to see you detach yourself from the rope without taking fall damage :D

So I take it you just looked at Worms games since Worms 2 via a telescope from a large distance? it's totally possible to have fall damage yet allow you to land safely at the same time.

So I take it you just looked at Worms games since Worms 2 via a telescope from a large distance? it's totally possible to have fall damage yet allow you to land safely at the same time.

Firstly, Worms DC has nothing to do with Worms games since Worms 2 -

The rope in Worms DC is insane once you have reached a certain velocity and it doesn't lose its kinetic energy either. Thus avoiding fall damage would be a task for the gods.

Firstly, Worms DC has nothing to do with Worms games since Worms 2 -
Not true.

The rope in Worms DC is insane once you have reached a certain velocity and it doesn't lose its kinetic energy either. Thus avoiding fall damage would be a task for the gods.
Also not true.

Not true.


Also not true.

Are you attempting to troll me now, or what?

Nope. It's just you made two provably false statements. WormsDC has everything to do with post-Worms 2 games - they wouldn't have half the weapons they have, for a start - and it is possible to slow down the Ninja Rope in WormsDC, even at high speeds. The Rope is a bit manic but it does lose its kinetic energy.

Nope. It's just you made two provably false statements. WormsDC has everything to do with post-Worms 2 games - they wouldn't have half the weapons they have, for a start - and it is possible to slow down the Ninja Rope in WormsDC, even at high speeds. The Rope is a bit manic but it does lose its kinetic energy.

"Nothing to do with it". Obviously what I meant was the ninja rope of Worms DC is completely different from the one of Worms 2. I don't know how franpa comes to think whether it's possible not to take fall damage in post-Worms 2 games is in any way relevant to whether it's possible in Worms DC. Because, and I hope you will agree, Worms DC DOES in fact have nothing to do with Worms 2 in a sense of Worms 2 did not influence Worms DC in the slightest.

and it is possible to slow down the Ninja Rope in WormsDC, even at high speeds. The Rope is a bit manic but it does lose its kinetic energy.

Well, here is something I want to show you - sorry for the videos going slow motion, fraps doesn't like WinUAE much. The rope is a lot faster in-game than it looks but you should be aware of that :p

Video 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dPALuJf4sM&feature=youtu.be)
Video 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emmhMr0pq8s&feature=youtu.be)

The rope might seem to behave rather sane in both videos, but only until you're told there was no key input in video 1 and also no input in video 2 until 0.04. On its own, the rope never comes to rest, and while "manually" doing so by lengthening it and manoeuvring it along cliffs is possible, it still takes a lot of time and occassionally it just doesn't work out. The main reason for this is instant mines; the rope isn't controllable enough to avoid these things as you try to slow it down, in innumerable situations.

Long story short, the rope easily gains high velocity in which it is hard to control and that's probably the reason why there is no fall damage, in case this is not a bug.

All I was saying was that if the lack of fall damage was indeed a bug then what you implied about fixing it requiring the worms to always incur fall damage, is stupid. They were smarter then you give them credit as is evidenced by the rope in Worms 2.

I believe the lack of fall damage was a feature as you can replicate the behavior in most (all?) later Worms games.

Of course I may have misinterpreted what you had meant.

thurbo can you please stop using this part of the forums to spread misinformation, spam and turn every thread into off topic?

thank you, the people that play the game.

I am not spamming, I am not spreading misinformation and it wasn't me who started off-topic discussions in this thread (though I'm not innocent as I have taken part to it, obviously). Working on your tone wouldn't hurt before responding again.


All I was saying was that if the lack of fall damage was indeed a bug then what you implied about fixing it requiring the worms to always incur fall damage, is stupid. They were smarter then you give them credit as is evidenced by the rope in Worms 2.

I believe the lack of fall damage was a feature as you can replicate the behavior in most (all?) later Worms games.

Of course I may have misinterpreted what you had meant.

To see what I meant, take a look at the videos. Not to take fall damage is hard in Worms DC because of the behaviour of the rope and how it handles loss of kinetic energy (namely, almost not at all). To make sure the player is able to avoid fall damage in the first place the rope would require to be tweaked significantly.

will the speechbank bug be solved this year? Cuz I would really like that.

Working on your tone wouldn't hurt before responding again.



shut the door on your way out

Wow, can this thread finally get some moderation or is this free cinema for the mods?

Actually, please open the first generation Worms forums again. I don't see the reason for letting them die.