Hey guys,

I thought I would make a quick topic specifically pointed at the landscape editor / import functions. There is a pretty good topic about useful features that could be adjusted / included in future updates, but I think the landscape functions deserve its own topic.

Here are a few items I personally want to see. If you agree, please say so, as I know Team17 values the opinions of its players, and will most likely be paying attention to this topic.

Please keep your comments positive and respectful of the developers and other players.

1. Larger map dimension limits.

This is probably the MOST requested upgrade feature. For mappers of all types, this is something that would be greatly appreciated. I don't think the map sizes need to be limitless, simply increased by a decent amount. I am thinking 3400 x 3400 pixels. Do you agree?

2. Wind particles in custom maps.

Currently you can not import a map and play it with wind particles. Those new particles look and behave great and I really think us custom mappers should have those particles. Of course since there are a bunch of them, we should be able to choose which particles to use. Since those particles are attached to specific backgrounds, we should be able to choose a "terrain style", which would include the particle set, background image, and water type. We should also be able to turn the background on and off (just use the gradient). This information should be saved in the LDS file (along with things like water level and mine placement).

3. Custom Border Types

This is a slightly more complicated point. I have tried to explain it below:

In the landscape editor, there is a button to toggle the border on or off. That is all good and well. It allows for a cave style map (with a possible water death) and an open style map (with a possible water death). In my crusade to make Worms Reloaded the BEST solution for custom mappers, I have yet another tweak I would like to request.

Whether you draw a map in game, or import one via TGA file, I believe you should be allowed 4 options for borders:

1. Full Border ON - Borders will seal off each side of the map (top, bottom, left and right). This allows for destructible landscapes that DO NOT have a possible water death. This style resembles a cavern.

2. Standard Border ON - This is the current option. Borders on top, left and right with the possibility of a water death. This style ALSO resembles a cavern.

3. Partial Border ON - This is the style I am REALLY campaigning for. This one would have a NO BORDER anywhere on the map. However, the map would still use a cavern view. This means that you can still drown and at the left or right edges of the map, if you get pushed off, you also die (due to falling into the water outside the boundaries of the map). The BIG PLUS for this type is that map makers can create a map that works like an open style, but is NOT LIMITED TO AN ISLAND. You could design a landscape that gives the illusion of continuing on to the left and right side, like a field or city scape or something. Additionally, any worms kicked UP out of the map would simply come down in their normal trajectory.

4. Borders OFF - This is also the current option - no borders at all, resulting in an open style map (like an island).

I have really obsessed over this and made up a nice little graphical diagram. I have a level that I REALLY want to convert to Worms Reloaded, but without an option like that, I would not be able to use it, or any other levels that are not either 1) an island, or 2) a cave.

http://www.mnpp.net/images/posts/border.jpg

Well that about wraps up my list of items that would pretty much perfect the landscape editor / importing functions of Worms Reloaded. What do you think?

I'd like larger brush sizes, and the ability to change to seed for random object placement, possibly the ability to place objects as well (Because I don't want a fire hydrant there I want it over here because I'm the level designer!).

Also, the interface is pretty dumb. I don't like the buttons that cycle through multiple options, because you keep clicking through to get to some option you want, and you accidentally click an extra time and pass it. Either have right click select the previous item, or just use a drop-down menu.

Finally, some documentation of the level format would be nice... but at that point, I might as well import an image instead.

This might be a double post because my last attempt didn't seem to get through :mad:

Anyways, the editor should have larger brush sizes, and either the ability to add objects (the fire hydrants and dump trucks, not the mines and barrels) or at least change the seed for random item placement.

Interface: I hate the buttons that cycle through various options, why not have right click select the previous item? or better yet: a drop-down menu.

Finally, documentation of the map format would be nice, although at that point I might as well just import an image instead.

Why not let the user selectively toggle each of the 3 borders?

Top - on/off
Bottom - on/off
Sides - on/off

That way, you'd have a few more options, 7 permutations in total:

http://a.imageshack.us/img827/8295/borderoptions.png




Plus, an option to confine camera panning to the extent of the map, as hundreds showed in his option 3.
Combined with any of the above, the dotted line would be the maximum the camera can go, allowing to create maps that are only an excerpt of a seemingly bigger one, but preventing the ugly look of a cut off map (in any direction that has no border).

PERFECT.

Time for an easy implementation. ;)

Big thumbs up on 2 and 3! I thought I was the only one dying to see the partial border you described, and I'd really like to be able to give custom maps backgrounds, as I really love the backgrounds in the game and the maps feel barren without them. I don't really mind about the larger maps thing myself, but I guess it couldn't hurt if people want it (Within reason, like you said). So I'm definitely in agreement with you, really hope those things get implemented.

If I was to make my own suggestions, there are two things I'd like to see. I'm a big fan of creating campaigns and such, and the landscape editor already allows you to make missions of a sort, so it would be nice to see that expanded a bit (And I think the first option could lead to some really interesting maps anyway).

1. Destructible and indestructible areas on the terrain.

What the title says. A tool that lets you set certain areas of the map to be indestructible while the rest of the map remains destructible (Or vice versa).

2. Crates.

The ability to place crates on the map, with predetermined weapons inside (Or random if you choose), in the same way we can put mines, barrels, et cetera.

(Incidentally, is it just me, or is not possible to make Warzone themed maps in the landscape editor? Is there a reason for that? Or do you have to like, beat the Warzone campaign or something?)

Excellent suggestions. I really want this thread to contain the DEFINITIVE list of things that could improve the landscape functions. I plan on submitting this to Team17 once it matures to completion.

I can only say "I agree with everything here!"

Hundreds is credit to editor!

Thanks D Wormkill! :D

Actually, MnP is currently starting work on the long-overdue MNP Alcatraz (working title) and it would consist of an inmates vs guards scenario. It would be really nice if I could specify which parts of the map are destructible. Although somehow I doubt that one will EVER be implemented.

1. Destructible and indestructible areas on the terrain.



Yes. That please. I've been dreaming of such a feature for a long time now. Perhaps when drawing a map, you could outline areas and tag them as "solid" while leaving the rest destructable.

Thanks D Wormkill! :D

Actually, MnP is currently starting work on the long-overdue MNP Alcatraz (working title) and it would consist of an inmates vs guards scenario. It would be really nice if I could specify which parts of the map are destructible. Although somehow I doubt that one will EVER be implemented.

I understand that this is the worms reloaded forum and I don't want to go off topic, so firstly, yes, all the ideas put forward get a thumbs up from me!

I just wanted to point out however that if you wanted to have a play and see how semi-destructable terrains feel I made a wormkit module for WA that allows just that: www.worms2d.info/wkIndiMask

Very nice Plutonic. Thanks for the FYI.