Thread dedicated to: those that can not host and to those that do not find WormKit (http://worms.thecybershadow.net/wormkit/) updates + WormNAT2 (http://forum.team17.co.uk/showthread.php?t=37390) to represent a solution because of various reasons OR to those that don't want to use Wormkit and the latest W:A update OR to those that run Linux on their computers and can't find a way to receive and accept external requests (can't act as servers) OR to those that find HostingBuddy to be annoying.

Introduction: I'm offering to give people the opportunity to host via my computer or through a friend's computer (that is able to receive and accept external requests).

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_forwarding): "Reverse port forwarding, or reverse port tunneling, is done by two components, usually software-based, where one component acts as a session-server - listening on a session-port, while the other component acts as a session-client to the session-server component - connecting to the session-server."

While reverse port forwarding is the best solution, it is too much of a hassle for both sides because of several reasons. So, I thought that a great way to encourage a client (the person that can't host) to use a server (the person that can provide hosting capabilities) would be to make the client take as few steps as possible. In order to achieve ease of use, creating a virtual private network is the best option.

Of course, VPNs may be more or less difficult to set, but that depends on the tool you are using. I could provide instructions for OpenVPN (http://openvpn.net/) or for VPN-X (http://www.birdssoft.com/en/), but I'll use Hamachi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamachi) for this tutorial as Hamachi is the most well known (free) and easy to set up VPN tool.

I. Setting up the server
In this context the server is the computer used by the client to host W:A games. The server is usually owned by a friend of yours. Follow these steps on the server machine:

1. Download and install the latest version of Hamachi (download (https://secure.logmein.com/products/hamachi/list.asp));

2. Create a new network and log on to it or join an existing one (it would be better to create a new one and optionally set a password for it);

3. Wait for the client to join the same network (you must give the client details about the network: name and password if any);

4. Now, let's say the server is listening for incoming connections on port 17017 (this is a port of choice, but it is important for the client to know it). Forward those connections to the client's Hamachi VPN IP (e.g. 5.100.173.76) on the same port (17017);

5. Find out what is your external IP (site (http://www.whatismyip.com/)) and communicate it to the client. Also, tell the client what port is the server listening for incoming connections

Here is an example of a correctly set up server:

Notes: You can see in the background that HostingWhore, the user that owns the network called "free_wa_hosting", is connected to the network "free_wa_hosting". HostingWhore is a Hamachi user on the server machine.

Doomino is another user connected to "free_wa_hosting". Doomino is a user on the client machine.

In the foreground, you can see that the server is listening for incomming connections on all available IPs (0.0.0.0) on port 17017 and is forwarding data to the client's machine using the client's machine Hamachi VPN IP (in this case, 5.176.236.189 - Doomino) on the same port- 17017.

You can see in the screen shot that the server is actually a virtual pc created using VirtualBox (http://www.virtualbox.org/)- that is because I personally like to manipulate W:A related stuff using a virtual pc (I'm making the additional steps of forwarding traffic from the host to the guest when helping somebody to host W:A games).

http://www.flash-bug.com/zMisc/serverSide.png

II. Setting up the client
In this context the client is the computer that is using the server to host W:A games. The client is usually owned by the person that can not host. Follow these steps on the client machine:

1. Download and install the latest version of Hamachi (download (https://secure.logmein.com/products/hamachi/list.asp));

2. Join the same Hamachi network as the server machine. You should get the network name and password from the owner of the network (that is usually the owner of the server machine). Do not proceed to the following step until the server is connected to the same network (that is because you can join a Hamachi network without having the owner online);

3. Get the following information about the server machine from the server owner: server machine external IP and listening port (for the purpose of hosting W:A games);

4. Assuming the server's external IP is 92.81.193.134 and that the server is listening on port 17017 for incoming connections, force W:A to host games using the server's IP and listening port as shown in the following image:

http://www.flash-bug.com/zMisc/clientSide.png

5. Next, if the server did its part of the job (correctly forwarding ports), the client is ready to host and welcome people to play with. :)

IMPORTANT NOTES: The client and server must remain connected to the Hamachi network throughout the entire gaming session. If either the client or the server disconnects from the network/Internet, the game is dropped. The hosting is done via the server, so all traffic passes through the server to the client.

Other notes: Lagging may occur if either the client or the server is stressing the incoming/outgoing bandwidth, but that is very likely not to happen during an usual game as a 3 to 5 players session barely takes 1KBps of incoming/outgoing traffic.

------------------------------

If the moderators decide to turn this into a sticky thread, I will be happy to help/assist anybody who needs to host via my computers.

The available Hamachi network for people in need is called:free_wa_hosting
The password assigned to this network is:wa

All you need to do is join the network, PM me through Hamachi and ask for a port;
Force W:A to the following address: hostingwhore.game-host.org
Each client must use a different port if multiple clients are playing at the same time using the same server.

You can contact me on Wormnet: ```MihaiS`sW`
Yahoo Messenger: mihais13@yahoo.com
Hamachi network ID: HostingWhore

I hope this will be helpful.

Peace and harmony,
MihaiS.

Current network status for free_wa_hosting:
http://www.flash-bug.com/zMisc/currentStatus7.png

Why not just use WormNAT2? Also, you realise that if you end up with a lot of traffic, your ISP is likely to cut you off?

Yeah it's still much less work to either forward ports yourself (I can't believe there's still people who don't know how this works) or, like Muzer said, use WormNAT2. =x

Also, you realise that if you end up with a lot of traffic, your ISP is likely to cut you off?

There's nothing to realize. I keep my computer opened 24/7 and stressing the bandwidth (6 Mbps) at maximum most of the time and nobody cares. But I also have access to several other computers that have separate connections to the Internet so I use those for helping people to host.

Yeah it's still much less work to either forward ports yourself (I can't believe there's still people who don't know how this works) or, like Muzer said, use WormNAT2. =x

In certain circumstances, you just can't get things to work the way you want to.

stressing the bandwidth (6 Mbps)

Mb/s or MB/s? The former is definitely not suitable for an invite of this type of usage. Continuing from Muzers comment; This type of activity over a network definitely does have the potential to arouse suspicion from any ISP, and you are suggesting that you put this weight on a friends shoulders? :P

The fact that there is another personal computer running the "server" adds a less significant, yet destructive problem, being that the connection is subject to numerous amounts of problems with packet loss, slower connections etc. that it would undoubtedly encounter during normal or higher stress. You also have the problem of no remote control over the PC running the server, should it be unoccupied while in use.

Needless to say, WormNAT2 is obviously a favorable option above this for the main reason that is uses a dedicated proxy server. I think most will agree it is also much easier to implement - I.e. No GUI, user configuration or manual launching at all

If you were to find yourself unable to install WormNAT2, I doubt you'd have much luck comprehending this setup

Mb/s or MB/s? The former is definitely not suitable for an invite of this type of usage. Continuing from Muzers comment; This type of activity over a network definitely does have the potential to arouse suspicion from any ISP, and you are suggesting that you put this weight on a friends shoulders? :P

6Mbps- 768KBps@download/56KBps@upload, but that is my connection. I have a free computer that has a separate connection to the Internet (12Mbps) that would support up to 120 clients without problems and I intend using it if I get too many requests. At the moment I'm only providing support for 5 guys so my 6Mbps connection can handle it, lol. I don't know what is the policy of the ISPs in your countries- I know I'm paying my ISP and I can do whatever I want... it's kind of funny to see you dwelling on this aspect.

The fact that there is another personal computer running the "server" adds a less significant, yet destructive problem, being that the connection is subject to numerous amounts of problems with packet loss, slower connections etc. that it would undoubtedly encounter during normal or higher stress.

Since I've started this 3 days ago, I've made numerous amounts of tests and the clients never failed to host and never reported lags, not even when playing on very large maps. Here's why:

Notice that a 4 players game on a tower map uses 0.04 KBps on the Incoming and 0.08 KBps on the Outgoing. At the bottom you can see that the server received 676 KB and sent 51,629 KB- those are the statistics over a day for a single client playing wxw, shoppa, big rr and other schemes. Also, observe the Sent/Received chart over the Internet for the live portforwarding application: it reports a peak of 212Bytes/64Bytes.
http://www.flash-bug.com/zMisc/usage1.png
Here's another screenshot indicating that 3 connections to the client use 104 Bps of the server's bandwidth. You can also read the "Status of the currently selected operation"- the total data from the client-side/server-side correspond with the NetLimiter reports.
http://www.flash-bug.com/zMisc/usage2.png

You also have the problem of no remote control over the PC running the server, should it be unoccupied while in use.p

There's no PC running the server- there is a PC acting as a server (because there really is no server software implied in this tutorial). And why would you want to control it? You don't need to control the server to host games and the server doesn't need to be dedicated. After both sides made the correct setting, they only need to stay connected to the same Hamachi network- that is just an icon in the system tray and nothing more.

Needless to say, WormNAT2 is obviously a favorable option above this for the main reason that is uses a dedicated proxy server. I think most will agree it is also much easier to implement - I.e. No GUI, user configuration or manual launching at all

Does this sound familiar to you: "Thread dedicated to: those that can not host and to those that do not find WormKit updates + WormNAT2 to represent a solution because of various reasons."

If you were to find yourself unable to install WormNAT2, I doubt you'd have much luck comprehending this setup

I don't care about how clumsy the client is. This is a collaborative method. You only need one average person to get this done. And this setup is not complicated at all... install Hamachi, forward a port, force an IP.

6Mbps- 768KBps@download/56KBps@upload
768Kbps. 768KBps is pretty darn high :P

768Kbps. 768KBps is pretty darn high :P

1Mb = 1024Kb
6Mbps = 6 * 1024Kbps = 6144Kbps
8Kb = 1KB
6144Kbps / 8 = 768KBps

and it's not high... a 20Mbps connection would be high.

True, but the dash generally denotes a range. I assumed you were posting the range your download speed normally is in.

No, I was using the dash to define 6Mbps.

Using download managers, I get to download stuff from the Internet at 750KBps+. And the servers I keep on my computers upload data at 50KBps+ and I don't like that. I'd have to buy more bandwidth to increase my upload speed, but my ISP does not support that in my area... :/

a 20Mbps connection would be high.
Yay?
http://speed.io/pics/1738/3682/speed.io.png

Yup! .

install Hamachi, forward a port, force an IP.
If you can forward ports, you can host normally.

EDIT: No, wait, never mind.

Still, I want some SPECIFIC examples of when WormNAT2 is not good enough. I can't think of a single reason why you'd want to use this over it.

If you can forward ports, you can host normally.

server & client: install Hamachi
server: forward a port
client: force IP

...so, I was referring to the server side (the one that can receive and accept external requests).

Still, I want some SPECIFIC examples of when WormNAT2 is not good enough. I can't think of a single reason why you'd want to use this over it.

If people tell me that they can't host even if they try using WormNAT2, I don't waste more of their time and my time, and I just tell them to install Hamachi, join my network and force W:A to my IP.

People have never told me that they couldn't host even with WormNAT2... (except for the time when it had DNS issues)

WormNAT2 doesn't fail, the user is what fails. The user probably downloaded it, stared at the file for a few seconds, then tried hosting in W:A and found it didn't work then got angry that WormNAT2 which they didn't install, didn't work.

I've redirected a lot of people to CyberShadow's thread regarding WormNAT2. Those that had their problem solved never provided feedback and those that didn't get it to work are now using different Hamachi networks to which I am connected. I just don't bother doing any research (or even try convincing them to allow me to provide remote support for setting up WormNAT2) when I can offer an easy and fast solution.

it's kind of funny to see you dwelling on this aspect.


I don't know about what policies stand in Romania, but here, numerous "random" connections uploading and downloading data to a single connection often suggests one thing that I'm sure we're all aware of - Good old P2P sharing! They're having big crackdowns on uploaders here in the UK

I also wonder how users might feel about the possibility of you/server holders sniffing their in-game conversations (Not an accusation, but another deterrent against this type of setup)

And yes, I am being tediously skeptical of this method for the reason that I have already seen you confusing lesser complex situations by advertising this :P

I also wonder how users might feel about the possibility of you/server holders sniffing their in-game conversations (Not an accusation, but another deterrent against this type of setup)

what a nonsense.

what a nonsense.
That isn't nonsense at all.
Are you the guy that MihaiS is selling all the sniffed credit card number to, or what? :eek:

I don't know about what policies stand in Romania, but here, numerous "random" connections uploading and downloading data to a single connection often suggests one thing that I'm sure we're all aware of - Good old P2P sharing! They're having big crackdowns on uploaders here in the UK

Romania is such a boring country. I should come in the UK to have a rush of adrenaline.

That isn't nonsense at all.
Are you the guy that MihaiS is selling all the sniffed credit card number to, or what? :eek:

Sniffing card numbers... sorry, that's HostingBuddy's job, not mine, but thanks for the idea.

I have in mind helping people. It would make more sense (...) to sniff while hosting (with or without the help of WormNat2) and participating to a game.

Some of you act like this method is going to bring the end of the world, of even worse... the end of WormNAT2. Nobody's using your computer and Internet connection, so why bother being negative about this? It's just an alternative- it's tested, it works well, it has never failed- what's wrong with that?

WormNAT2 has never failed either, if properly installed and not just downloaded and stared at.

It is easier to support 1 working method then 2.

The T17 community is not the Wormnet community, otherwise HostingBuddy should cease to exist. You see, it's not hard to support different alternatives as long as they work.

It is easier to support 1 working method then 2.

you dont support nothing, so why crying around franpa?

HostingBuddy's current raison d'être is that it is very simple to use. Assuming people don't want to customize the scheme, it's very simple to set up a game with default settings for a scheme and an appropriate map.

Yeah, but we all know how unreliable HostingBuddy is.

MihaiS I don't think anyone here wants to bash you for your project, it's just that you're re-inventing the bike with square wheels.. Nice effort though.

Do I look like I need your nice comments to be able to help people? Having this thread is enough.

Do you want to help? Or do you want to be known as the helper?

I already support 7 clients. Seven clients that don't need to have Wormkit and the latest W:A update, seven clients that don't have to use HostingBuddy.

I guess I want both.

Why did they pick your method? I hope it's something other than random people complaining that they can't host and MihaiS pointing them at his method as the only one.

I redirect people to this thread. The heading clearly states: Thread dedicated to: those that can not host and to those that do not find WormKit updates + WormNAT2 to represent a solution because of various reasons OR to those that don't want to use Wormkit and the latest W:A update.

Still, I wonder how many of your users actually tried WormNAT2... I wouldn't be surprised that people who are afraid to ask a question in #Help or do a search on Google wouldn't bother researching other solutions when they have one right in front of them, no matter the relative disadvantages...

The only disadvantage is that those who use my method depend on a third party. Using WormNAT2 isn't any different from that.

My method offers a bit of flexibility, not constraining people to update W:A and to use Wormkit. From different points of view, that may or may not be to the client's advantage.

do you keep your internet connection on 24/7 Mihais?

Yes, I do.

You can use any version of W:A with WormNAT2. The update restriction applies to clients, because versions prior to 3.6.28.0 could only connect to games hosted on the port 17011. The same restriction applies to your method. The disadvantage I was talking about is mostly regarding the complicated setup procedure, as well as having all traffic relayed via a VPN through a home connection (for comparison, the WormNAT2 server is hosted on a dedicated server with an unmetered 100Mbit connection). Also, if I'm understanding this correctly, it is possible to host only one game at the same time using your method? I guess you could allocate a larger pool of ports which would decrease the probability of collisions, or assign a port per user, but that would require human interaction from the maintainer's side for every new user.

From where I stand, it really does look like you're reinventing the bike with square wheels, as I've yet to hear from a person who can't use WormNAT2 for a good reason.

mihais`s description appears to be complicated. but its very simple for clients.

you must only set his dyndns and a given port in worms once (atm he must reserves them by hand).

when this is done, the day by day use is provided and you must do nothing else then connecting to him with hamachi bevor hosting.

WormNAT 2 is ok for me.

Altho desyncs can happen once in a while. But I'm guessing this is because the server gets quite busy sometimes.

The server being the games host. there is no central server other then the IRC channels like #AnythingGoes etc.

You can use any version of W:A with WormNAT2. The update restriction applies to clients, because versions prior to 3.6.28.0 could only connect to games hosted on the port 17011. The same restriction applies to your method.

I was talking about clients too, and using my method does not require having the latest W:A update, nor using Wormkit.

The disadvantage I was talking about is mostly regarding the complicated setup procedure,

Hamachi is already popular among gamers... installing it, joining a network and forcing W:A to use a specific IP shouldn't be too hard.

as well as having all traffic relayed via a VPN through a home connection (for comparison, the WormNAT2 server is hosted on a dedicated server with an unmetered 100Mbit connection).

My 6Mbit and 12Mbit connections can't beat that, but can support more than 100 clients playing simultaneously.

Also, if I'm understanding this correctly, it is possible to host only one game at the same time using your method?

Let me reuse the following screenshot that shows the user Doomino and Bonecollector playing at the same time:
http://www.flash-bug.com/zMisc/currentStatus.png

I guess you could allocate a larger pool of ports which would decrease the probability of collisions, or assign a port per user, but that would require human interaction from the maintainer's side for every new user.

Yes, at the moment I manually define a new port for every user joining the network. If it happens that I am not available, the user will receive his port number when I get back.

From where I stand, it really does look like you're reinventing the bike with square wheels.

Some may like riding square-wheeled bikes :p

mihais`s description appears to be complicated. but its very simple for clients.

you must only set his dyndns and a given port in worms once (atm he must reserves them by hand).

when this is done, the day by day use is provided and you must do nothing else then connecting to him with hamachi bevor hosting.

Yeah. And, maybe, in the future, me and Lookias will work on implementing this as a Wheat Snooper feature (option) for those that are not able to host.

I thought Hamachi was only popular for playing pirated games online. :p

It is a good VPN solution and it's also used to access services on computers otherwise unreachable.

It is a good VPN solution and it's also used to access services on computers otherwise unreachable.

Yeah yeah yeah. The only reason I can think of why WormNAT2 would fail to work is because someone is using a cracked copy. And I also agree with:

MihaiS I don't think anyone here wants to bash you for your project, it's just that you're re-inventing the bike with square wheels.. Nice effort though.

Thanks for your effort, though.

I was talking about clients too, and using my method does not require having the latest W:A update, nor using Wormkit.
Yes it does (the former), at least newer than .28.0. I suggest you put a little more research into your statements, especially since CyberShadow told you the reason!

Yeah yeah yeah. The only reason I can think of why WormNAT2 would fail to work is because someone is using a cracked copy. And I also agree with:

i know one more.

Would you like to share it with the class?

Would you like to share it with the class?
wotmkit doesnt run on linux, mihais solution works perfect on my linux.

Thanks for your effort, though.

It's funny to see you acting like I was seeking for your approval.

wotmkit doesnt run on linux, mihais solution works perfect on my linux.

That's a good point, I hadn't thought of that, however, I think people clever enough to use Linux will probably be clever enough to forward ports...

It's funny to see you acting like I was seeking for your approval.

I'm not. I still think your idea is pretty much useless, but I know our relatively small community would die if there were no people searching for solutions to common problems. The problem solving is what I approve, not your silly (superfluous) idea.

The problem solving is what I approve, not your silly (superfluous) idea.

Tell that to those that already benefit from my method.

Altho desyncs can happen once in a while.That's probably the desynchronization bug in 3.6.29.0...

Tell that to those that already benefit from my method.
I'm still inclined to believe that most of them made an uninformed decision :)

Also, MihaiS' method requires >=3.6.28.0 for clients if the game is hosted on a port other than 17011 (this is the same port that's being forwarded). If each user gets their own port, only one of them will be able to benefit (or not?) from the capability to play with un-updated users.

My 6Mbit and 12Mbit connections can't beat that, but can support more than 100 clients playing simultaneously.So what happens when you want to download the latest version/episode of <insert name of software/TV show here> from a P2P network? :)

That's a good point, I hadn't thought of that, however, I think people clever enough to use Linux will probably be clever enough to forward ports...

i knew that someone will say that xD.

whatever you dont need to open something on an externel device (e.g. a router) while using hamachi, you must just register on mihais`s server and start hamachi.

I'm still inclined to believe that most of them made an uninformed decision :)

With respect, CyberShadow, you are free to join the network and ask every client that is online if they were informed about WormNAT2 before using my method.

Also, MihaiS' method requires >=3.6.28.0 for clients if the game is hosted on a port other than 17011 (this is the same port that's being forwarded). If each user gets their own port, only one of them will be able to benefit (or not?) from the capability to play with un-updated users.

I just said people don't need to use the latest W:A update (3.6.29.0) and Wormkit. I never said it works for any W:A version.

So what happens when you want to download the latest version/episode of <insert name of software/TV show here> from a P2P network? :)

I would limit my download/upload rate, but I don't do that. I believe it's illegal.

With respect, CyberShadow, you are free to join the network and ask every client that is online if they were informed about WormNAT2 before using my method.
This implies that either you don't know the reason they chose your method over WormNAT2, or that you think I won't take your word for it. Why?

This implies that either you don't know the reason they chose your method over WormNAT2, or that you think I won't take your word for it. Why?

You're the one expressing doubt. I just invited you.

You're the one expressing doubt. I just invited you.
That doesn't really answer my question... first you are protective, then you turn indifferent and suggest that the accusator (me) do their own research on a question, the answer of which I'd expect you knew. I'm not going to jump to conclusions just based on that, frankly I'm just interested in genuine reasons why people wouldn't want to use WormNAT2 (one I already know - Linux).

I just said people don't need to use the latest W:A update (3.6.29.0) and Wormkit. I never said it works for any W:A version.
You don't need to use the latest W:A update for WormNAT2 either.

That doesn't really answer my question... first you are protective, then you turn indifferent and suggest that the accusator (me) do their own research on a question, the answer of which I'd expect you knew. I'm not going to jump to conclusions just based on that, frankly I'm just interested in genuine reasons why people wouldn't want to use WormNAT2 (one I already know - Linux).

I already told you... I don't bother anymore explaining to each user that can not host how any of the available options work.

Since you made WormNAT2 available, I sent a lot of users to read your thread. Some found it useful, some didn't. I offered my support for those who didn't manage to set up WormNAT2... some were so slow I even tried to convince them to let me set it up for them using TeamViewer (bad idea- most of them thought I wanted to gain control over their computer...).

Some are afraid of that stupid virus alert they get about Wormkit, others don't trust the application thinking it may be a spying tool (even if that sounds funny); there are persons that end up with W:A crashing when using Wormkit (must be their fault)...

Don't imagine that everybody having a problem will create an account on this forum and start describing their problems... some barely speak English, but are willing to host. I just tell them to install Hamachi, join a network (I'm not surprised that they don't ask me what is Hamachi) and send them a picture showing how their W:A server configuration should look like.

To sum it up, some consider my method giving results faster (if not better). Despite of people saying it is more complicated, it seems that individuals with less intellectual capacity are able to enjoy hosting on their own using my method.

+I have friends that can host without problems, but join my VPN-X/OpenVPN/other_Hamachi networks so I can moderate their games when asked. I'm like a private M3ntal to them :p (I only described an advantage of hosting via my PC... friends are friends).

so, you think that...

1) download Hamachi
2) install Hamachi
3) configuring hamachi
4) configuring W:A's port away from 17011
5) connecting to you over Hamachi

is easier then...

1) download wormkit
2) install wormkit
2) place included wormnat2 dll file into W:A folder
3) run wormkit.exe

?

Fair enough. Maybe we need a WormKit installation tutorial with pictures... :rolleyes:

so, you think that...

1) download Hamachi
2) install Hamachi
3) configuring hamachi
4) configuring W:A's port away from 17011
5) connecting to you over Hamachi

is easier then...

1) download wormkit
2) install wormkit
2) place included wormnat2 dll file into W:A folder
3) run wormkit.exe

?

1) you download both, so that's redundant to mention (although some may already have Hamachi installed);
2) installing Hamachi is not the same as installing Wormkit (for a novice, it's easier to install Hamachi... you don't even need an archiving tool to unzip files);
3) you don't have to configure Hamachi, just connect to a network;
4) the Hamachi installer places a shortcut on the desktop (so the more unexperienced user can find a thing to double click on).
5) you mentioned 4 Wormkit steps :p

*sigh* Franpa, don't you understand? My method doesn't require any file handling... you don't double click Wormkit to install it, the .dll file doesn't place itself in the right place and:

Some are afraid of that stupid virus alert they get about Wormkit, others don't trust the application thinking it may be a spying tool (even if that sounds funny); there are persons that end up with W:A crashing when using Wormkit (must be their fault)...

...some consider my method giving results faster (if not better). Despite of people saying it is more complicated, it seems that individuals with less intellectual capacity are able to enjoy hosting on their own using my method.

AND Hamachi is already mentioned in the Hosting Guide (http://worms2d.info/Hosting_Guide)- I just give it better ways of use with W:A.

For the last time, THIS method is a working alternative to WormNAT2 and it's already in use. It's not meant to replace WormNAT2.

Well, maybe CyberShadow can create an installer for WormKit that automatically places the DLLs correctly, creates a shortcut on the desktop with a nice icon and pops up a notice about the possible virus false positive alert.
:D

Well, maybe CyberShadow can create an installer for WormKit that automatically places the DLLs correctly,
He can't do that! it will end the simplicity wars between Mihais and Cybershadow :(

Well, maybe CyberShadow can create an installer for WormKit that automatically places the DLLs correctly, creates a shortcut on the desktop with a nice icon and pops up a notice about the possible virus false positive alert.
:D

And HostingBuddy should definitely advertise the installer if it will be released.

And HostingBuddy should definitely advertise the installer if it will be released.
I can't tell if you're serious or not :-/

I can't tell if you're serious or not :-/

I am serious. HostingBuddy should inform its summoner in the lobby about the availability of Wormkit + WormNAT2 (installer/archive... whatever). I'm sure people aren't using hosting buddy just because it makes available a set of schemes and maps.

I believe HostingBuddy already tells people about WormNAT2...

I believe HostingBuddy already tells people about WormNAT2...

I am sorry... I never used HostingBuddy to host. I only joined games hosted with the help of HostingBuddy. I incorrectly assumed HB doesn't inform users about the availability of WormKit... mainly because it doesn't make sense for a user to continue using HB even after he's informed of a better hosting solution.

Yes. But if that kind of users didn't exist, you probably wouldn't have other clients except lookias here :p

Lookias can host on his own. We're testing stuff together.